Lets talk...Wayne Rooney

Nem
5901 posts Big Money Move
Let me just start off by saying Wayne has had a fantastic career to date. He has won many team honours, as well as personal ones. He has had some standout seasons while at United, and one or two low key.

Now, onto my point

Has he developed into the player many thought he would when he first burst onto the scene back in 02/03? Has he become as good as he ought to have done, has he fulfilled his potential?

In his early days he was explosive. He had pace, and the power to go with it.



Who could forget his performances at Euro 2004, when he announced himself on the big stage. Possibly my favourite tournament from an England POV during my lifetime.

Now plenty of you will know my thoughts on the 'English disease', the lad culture amongst our youth and the bad habits that go with it. It has been widely documented down the years that Wayne has had trouble with one or two, be it smoking or drinking.
I'm of the opinion that this has hindered Wayne, stopped him from being at the very top along with the likes of Ronaldo, Messi, Ibra etc. A case of what might have been, as we have seen before with Gazze (although Wayne has had a much more successful career tbf).

He's had a few poor games at the start of this season, and I have no doubt he'll bounce back and go on a good run, but how long do we give him at the top level with United? I think has 2-3 years left in him before returning to his boyhood club or even MLS.

I dont want this to be viewed as me bashing Rooney, and I hope it doesn't come across like that.

Lets see what RF has to say on the subject, so over to you

(P.S May turn this into a series if thread proves popular)

Comments

  • Ridikuluz
    7696 posts League Winner
    His game has suffered with complacency for a while. Seemingly content to coast by games. Motivational issues are the reason now for his decline and very much throughout his career for never truly fulfilling his capabilities. Although, I guess blame could also be attributed to the fact he has basically been a glorified utility man for most of his career. I mean, what is Rooney's best position?
  • Bob Loblaw
    11247 posts Has That Special Something
    I think he has done quite well compared to other young British players around the same time who were hyped to a similar level (i.e. Alan Smith, James Milner etc.)
  • Kyle1996
    2046 posts Fans' Favourite
    Drifting around the forward line with Ronaldo and Tevez produced some of the best attacking football we'll see in a long time at the club, since then he never works well with another striker who is more technical and lacks natural pace like Berbatov and van Persie. Playing as the main striker there was a point in 2009 and 2012 where you thought he could become a world class number 9 but it wasn't to be. His decline since 2012 has been fairly rapid and it's a frustrating sight every week.

  • Wardhiigley
    1974 posts Play-Off Hero
    I've actually been thinking about his career this past week. I saw a comment in The Daily Telegraph the other day that said Rooney was like the kid in the playground, play him upfront and he drops deep, play him deep and he wants to be upfront. He's that **** that just always wants to be on the ball even if it's to the hindrance of the team.

    I think he's purely still at United because of his commercial pull, he'd have been gone 4-5 years ago if he wasn't so bankable.
  • Ridikuluz
    7696 posts League Winner
    I think Ferguson was very close to selling him in the end. The issue I think he had was that the team really wasn't that strong, and his replacements - Kagawa for the #10, Welbeck + one upfront, just weren't good enough. I seem to remember strong interest in Lewandowski, but that was never happening. In the end it would have worked, because he rushed landed van Persie, and would have been able to deal with all the blacklash of selling Rooney the following season had he stayed.
  • Kanturk
    715 posts Sunday League Hero
    Feguson ruined him making him into a better version of Ji Sung Park out on the wing. Although with his natural physical shape he was never going to mantain his explosiveness even into his early 30's. He was the best young player I've ever seen.
  • Kyle1996
    2046 posts Fans' Favourite
    edited August 2015
    If Ferguson had stayed for one more season I think Rooney wouldn't be here. Moyes completely bottled any chance of putting his own mark on the squad and cemented Rooney's place for the foreseeable future.

    Even if he has an atrocious season it's impossible at this stage to see him receiving the treatment van Persie got this summer because of his stature at the club.
  • Bob Loblaw
    11247 posts Has That Special Something
    Kyle1996 wrote: »
    If Ferguson had stayed for one more season I think Rooney wouldn't be here. Moyes completely bottled any chance of putting his own mark on the squad and cemented Rooney's place for the foreseeable future.

    Even if he has an atrocious season it's impossible at this stage to see him receiving the treatment van Persie got this summer because of his stature at the club.

    He will be Uniteds Gerrard.
  • Wardhiigley
    1974 posts Play-Off Hero
    I think Ferguson would have sold him sooner than 2012-13 if the decisions really was entirely his. Ronaldo leaving killed any chance of that, massively weakened United's image and selling the most popular English player would have all but killed it and the Glazer's knew it. If United had had another iconic player then Rooney would have never ever have been able to bully Ferguson around for £300K a week and not even mid-season no less.
  • Hitman_Hatton
    14382 posts Has That Special Something
    Two years on

    Anymore thoughts?
  • Andy
    7850 posts League Winner
    What happened to the @Nem account
  • Ridikuluz
    7696 posts League Winner
    I think all the comments above from @Ridikuluz, @Kyle1996, and @Wardhiigley are really all needed on the topic. In regard to @Wardhiigley's marketing point, it isn't mere coincidence that #Pogba is being milked as much as physically possible in the same season the club are slowly pushing the ball into Rooney's court to take off. Factor in a potential summer swoop for Antoine 'my idol is Beckham' Grie7mann and the only discernible trait Rooney offers the club is pretty much gone.
  • Jenko
    13845 posts Has That Special Something
    I think Ferguson would have sold him sooner than 2012-13 if the decisions really was entirely his. Ronaldo leaving killed any chance of that, massively weakened United's image and selling the most popular English player would have all but killed it and the Glazer's knew it. If United had had another iconic player then Rooney would have never ever have been able to bully Ferguson around for £300K a week and not even mid-season no less.
    Two years on

    Anymore thoughts?

    I'm currently reading SAF's autobiography and the general feel so far leads me to be believe that @Wardhiigley's analysis of the situation is a good one. He's always referring to those 'star' players that embody United (in different senses), once Ronaldo had gone it was only really Rooney left. There was van Persie too, not long after, but Ferguson talks about footballing mercenaries a bit and I don't think he ever saw RvP as somebody that embodied United.

    He didn't see Rooney as a necessity, but he didn't demand the board sell him as he did with Beckham, because he felt that Rooney had always managed his celebrity profile around football, rather than the other way around.
  • CM10
    5043 posts Big Money Move
    Rooney was always going to find it difficult to improve on the level he was producing around 2009 but he really didn't do himself any favours in how he looked after his body compared to some of the other great players of the last decade like Ronaldo and Ibrahimovic. Both of them treated their bodies like temples and have probably got better with age, if anything.

    Perhaps Rooney starting at such a young age meant he would naturally slow down a bit quicker than those two, who are also both physical freaks, but there's definitely a complacent side to him which you would never see of most other top players. The pictures of him getting hammered last year proved that.

    I think Ferguson recognised that and is why there were all the transfer stories circulating at the end of the 12/13 season. I suspect Ferguson didn't think Moyes had the presence of mind to bin him and wanted to give him an out by planting the seed before he'd taken the job but Moyes royally **** it up by giving him a lucrative long-term contract.
  • XxRichiexRichxX
    31363 posts National Team Captain
    CM10 wrote: »
    Rooney was always going to find it difficult to improve on the level he was producing around 2009 but he really didn't do himself any favours in how he looked after his body compared to some of the other great players of the last decade like Ronaldo and Ibrahimovic. Both of them treated their bodies like temples and have probably got better with age, if anything.

    Perhaps Rooney starting at such a young age meant he would naturally slow down a bit quicker than those two, who are also both physical freaks, but there's definitely a complacent side to him which you would never see of most other top players. The pictures of him getting hammered last year proved that.

    I think Ferguson recognised that and is why there were all the transfer stories circulating at the end of the 12/13 season. I suspect Ferguson didn't think Moyes had the presence of mind to bin him and wanted to give him an out by planting the seed before he'd taken the job but Moyes royally **** it up by giving him a lucrative long-term contract.

    I agree with your second paragraph. Playing top level football at such a young age that he started takes a toll on the body.
  • Hitman_Hatton
    14382 posts Has That Special Something
    A new chapter about to start for the boy.
  • TheMeerkat
    589 posts Sunday League Hero
    People say Fergie was going to weed him out because he could see the 'decline'. The man scored 34 goals in 11/12 and in Fergie's final season he got 16 goals and 14 assists playing as a 10 and he missed 3 months of the season, would've easily hit 20+ on both.

    He carried our team in the Moyes season, he gets nowhere near enough credit for getting 19 goals and 14 assists in that awful team. He was our top scorer in 14/15 as well even though he played as a central midfielder for large parts and he would've hit 20+ goals if he didn't get that 2 month injury in 15/16 in February and when he returned he played as Centre mid for the rest of the games.

    My point is yes he has been declining but people saying he's been awful or useless for 3/4 years is utter complete nonsense, he's still been good but not the same world class star he was.
  • Tornado31619
    15747 posts World Class
    Wazza's retired from international footie.
  • Ash
    21413 posts Club Captain
    thank god for that, couldn't take another tourny with him
  • Nem
    5901 posts Big Money Move
    Having a great time over in the MLS.

    Talk of him being voted MVP.
  • Andy99TradeZ
    13648 posts Has That Special Something
    Nem wrote: »
    Having a great time over in the MLS.

    Talk of him being voted MVP.

    Wait... This hitmanhatton?
  • Nem
    5901 posts Big Money Move
    Nem wrote: »
    Having a great time over in the MLS.

    Talk of him being voted MVP.

    Wait... This hitmanhatton?

    It is I, @Andy99TradeZ
  • Smudge
    4520 posts National Call-Up
    Me ol mucker
  • Andy99TradeZ
    13648 posts Has That Special Something
    Nem wrote: »
    Nem wrote: »
    Having a great time over in the MLS.

    Talk of him being voted MVP.

    Wait... This hitmanhatton?

    It is I, @Andy99TradeZ

    Why using an old profile?
  • Nem
    5901 posts Big Money Move
    Nem wrote: »
    Nem wrote: »
    Having a great time over in the MLS.

    Talk of him being voted MVP.

    Wait... This hitmanhatton?

    It is I, @Andy99TradeZ

    Why using an old profile?

    I'm back on my account having lost access to it a few years back (couldn't get the security code through for some reason).
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