Skills spam-fest incoming
August 8, 2020 3:19PM
edited August 2020
Aaaaaaand I'm not buying:
Skill Moves Improvements
We’ve made some very important changes and improvements to Skill Moves in FIFA 21.
General Improvements
Reduced the penalty and error for chaining Skill Moves.
Increased the number of complex Skill Moves that you can chain without the ball getting away to 3, up from 2 in FIFA 20.
Complex Skill Moves examples include Elastico, Drag Back and La Croquetta.
Increased the number of normal Skill Moves that you can chain without the ball getting away to 6, up from 3 in FIFA 20.
Normal Skill Moves example include Stop and Turn, Fake Shot and Heel to Heel.
Skill Moves Improvements
We’ve made some very important changes and improvements to Skill Moves in FIFA 21.
General Improvements
Reduced the penalty and error for chaining Skill Moves.
Increased the number of complex Skill Moves that you can chain without the ball getting away to 3, up from 2 in FIFA 20.
Complex Skill Moves examples include Elastico, Drag Back and La Croquetta.
Increased the number of normal Skill Moves that you can chain without the ball getting away to 6, up from 3 in FIFA 20.
Normal Skill Moves example include Stop and Turn, Fake Shot and Heel to Heel.
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Comments
>Drag Back
Pick one
Its already Volta on grass.
Yep, unbearable.
They talk about all these "realistic" improvements to make the game more accurately depict real football, then finish with "oh, but we've made it easier to chain the **** out of ridiculously unrealistic skill moves that are already over powered and spammed in the extreme".
Good stuff.
Fifa 20 was booring and had very small skill gap because you couldn't do anything in attack
Why is the answer to some people to fight hideous, broken mechanics with more hideous, broken mechanics?
The actual resolution is that EA should nerf those sort of exploits, not allow them to ruin to the game and then combat it with making ridiculous, FIFA Street skills even easier to spam.
I won't buy it, I'm ****ing sick of the garbage. Chaining ridiculous skills moves that you don't even see in real life isn't football, and neither is doing 500 drag backs a match.
By removing the ridiculous defensive tactics also.
There was a time these didn't exist and nobody complained about 10 men behind the ball and stamina etc.
If the game is going to be good then surely balance is key?
Ultra defensive tactics and ridiculously OP skills chained together doesn't sound very balanced.
By fixing defending.
Was playing last night and my opponent was clearly trying to do the TOTS objectives in Rivals. I'm 4-0 up, so I figure I'd stop and let him get his two goals. That was on 70 minutes.
I let go of the controller.
He didn't get the ball back from me until injury time. My VVD was shielding on his own, turning away from the tackle, protecting the ball, and taking actual steps away from the attacker with the ball at his feet.
The defending portion of the game plays itself. In fact, it's STILL better to just not try to defend and make tackles yourself. If you try that, your defender runs over the ball, runs past the ball, misses the ball, or falls over. Leave it to the AI, and you'll probably get the ball back.
The fix for that is not "make attacking even more like Dance Dance Revolution."
@Gromit @NathW90 You guys just want the game play to be noob friendly.
It takes skill to master to do these skills.
Plus the only skills you can chain are the basic ones like the ball roll, fake shoot, Cruyff turn
The OP skills like Elastico,Dragback, mcgeady spin etc you can only do 3 at once and there is a delay inbetween.
They are easy to defend when you actually to control your defenders and not hope the AI wins the ball for you.
They tried manual defending in fifa 20. Early access the game was fine but noibs complained defending is too hard. First patch on release day, AI defending overload ball side BS is back.
It takes skill to defend without ridiculous levels of assistance, as well, but I notice you aren't bothered about that as long as you can CRUSH THOSE NOOBS with La Croqueta after La Croqueta.
You should definitely say "noob" again, though. It makes you seem so skilled and clever and not like a 14-year-old at all.
Absolute garbage.
What I want is a football game that rewards people who actually master the real arts of football, not one that instead rewards spamming the laughable barage of unrealistic skills that you almost NEVER see in actual football matches, and certainly not to anywhere the extent that FIFA has now made possible.
A number of the skills in the game have no place on an actual football pitch. I'm sure it does take time to learn them, but that's not at all the point. The point is that they are mostly unrealistic, FIFA Street **** that don't actually exist in professional football.
Tbh mate 90% of the skills I see day to day are just a simple 2 to 4 star skills that require minimal input that I can do myself.
Doesn't mean I think the game should revolve around them though. Watch 5 mins of a real football match then watch 5 mins of a FUT match, not at all realistic. Its a game I get it, but its become a joke.
https://streamable.com/i0c9uj
Watch this goal.
All i did was do heel to heel, a fake shot then lateral heel to heel. All of this are 2 star basic skills and even fake shot counts as a skill. That counts as three, if the guy moved the keeper right i can't even do a ball roll to the left to shoot other side because my player will most likely lose the ball
In FIFA 20, if you include any complex skill then you can only do 2 skills. Most skill moves you have do it from a stationary position so you have do a fake shot to stop the ball that's already one skill, So in reality you can only do one complex skill that's why everyone was doing drag backs this year because that is the only skill move you can do in multiple directions so its hard to predict made fifa 20 dull with no creativity.
Other skill moves like scoop turn, elastico you can only go in one direction at a time so once the animation starts a good oppoenet will cover that side and you are stuck. In division 1, games are 0-0, 1-0,1-1,2-1. All the games are cagey, we rely on EA BS rebounds goals to decide games because you can't get any space if someone is decent at defending. FIFA 20 was the most boring fifa in recent time.
Increasing it was a good move and will bring creativity in attack instead of always going back because there is no space. its very easy to defend skills because their animation is slow and jockeying turns faster than any skill.
In my opinion if someone is spamming La Croquetas in a straight line and you can't stop it then you just can't defend. Skills moves are easy to do, you just flick right analog up/down, left/right just spamming skills anyhow isn't gonna beat anybody decent at defending. Mastering skills moves isn't about just spamming, its about when to do them and which skill to do for each situation.
Defending in FIFA, the AI position your defending, the AI blocks shots, intercept ,tackles by themselves and no even talking the the tactics like press after possession loss, pressure on heavy touch, team press and co where the AI presses with no user input.
If FIFA can't be like real life, no video game can be like real life. You think its realistic that Shroud can play COD and quick scope people all over the place? This take skills to get that good so maybe learn how to defend.
There's no point in arguing with pro-skillers, there will always be excuses and it always reverts back to "you probably just can't defend" rather than, to use your example, them actually seeing a problem with the fact that you CAN spam la croqueta's in the game without the game penalising you for it. It. Is. Not. Football.
In line with that, why is the other answer always "well we need insanely unrealistic skills that you never see in actual football to combat the other bad mechanics!". NO, FFS, WHAT WE NEED IS A BALANCED GAME WHERE WE DON'T NEED ONE RIDICULOUS, OVER POWERED MECHANIC TO COMBAT ANOTHER. That's what we should be fighting for, but the truth is people like you don't really want or care about that, you want to be able to play the game like FIFA Street and are glad that that's the way the game is heading.
If you're happy playing a football game that rewards you for not playing it anything like real football, that's great for you. For people like me who actually want a game that at least attempts to mimic the actual sport it's based on rather than just be a playground for kids who love "skillz", I'll probably just carry on with PES, which I found fairly enjoyable this year.
**** me, imagine a game that actually rewards tactical decisions, smart passing and clever movement, rather than just pace and tricks. **** FIFA and it's ant-football meta, honestly.
PES is trash. What they achieved with their tiny budget is impressive but the game is bad even worse than fifa. You still just hold down 2 buttons on defense. There are also many unrealistic and OP things in PES like their finese shot.There is even more AI in PES than FIFA
It's ironic that most of you use PES as reference to compare to FIFA, if it's so good why not quit fifa to play PES it's even free.
Real life football is done in 90 minutes plus. Barcelona have all the time in the world to break a defense. You can't pass patiently like Barcelona do in real life because we only have 12 minutes to play the match not 90. EA tried that this year that's why this year was booring. People pass for passing sake because there is no attacking runs, no space and they waste all the time passing around in midfield.
You can only chain 3 skill moves if a complex skill is included. As i said skill moves is ONLY EFFECTIVE if it's unpredictable. Someone just spamming 3 la croqueta shouldn't anyone decent at defending.
You keep saying "FIFA STREET" as if EA invented their own ridiculous skill moves. All this were done by players. Plus almost of those fancy skills like Bolasie flick, Hocus Pocus etc are not effective anyway. Everyone will do the simple ones like ball roll, dragback, fake shot etc
The "lEaRn 2 DeFeNd" nonsense needs to go, mate. Sorry, but your entire arguments are based on "Everybody else sucks." and it makes it hard to take seriously. Of course everybody else isn't as good as D1 player. But guess what? D1 is a tiny, tiny subset of the FIFA playing population.
Watching a GOOD skiller play is entertaining. I've played ONE person this year who was a genuinely tremendous skiller, and I only played him because he had clearly relegated himself for objectives. It was fun to try to defend against. He whipped me but good, and watching him walk through my defence using the right skill moves at the right time with PIM Ronaldinho was impressive. He was a bit showy, but every skill move had a purpose. THAT is how skilling should be.
The problem is when you play someone who is NOT a good skiller who still uses skills. The millions of other players are sat here facing people who spam skill move after skill move without any sort of thought. Those millions of other players could be the best at defending, and they'd still get trounced.
Why?
Because defending in FIFA 18/19/20 (and others) has been and is ABYSMAL. You can talk about your AI defending and the auto-press as much as you want, but those things are basically requirements at this point due to the failings of the rest of the defensive system. If they weren't there, every game would be 19-18 after extra time.
Manually-controlled defenders just randomly fall over, at times. Especially when your own AI-controlled player decides to chase the ball and take you out. You can read an opponent's skill move perfectly, move toward the ball, and watch your defender just run past it. How about giving up on tackling and just trying to block instead? Position your defender manually in the perfect place, and he might do an animation that causes him to duck out of the way. Nick the ball off an opponent's foot as he's skilling, with perfect timing? Foul, because of a delayed input. Oh...now you're a goal down because your keeper hit the "slow dive" animation on the penalty, even though you went the right way. Double up and cover the man to stop him getting out of a tight spot? Well...yeah...but the second man has decided to ignore your command. No, wait...here he comes...strolling over to get into place because another player attacking isn't really all that urgent a problem. I know! I'll change to the covering player and push him into position manually, myself. No, wait...the game has selected my central midfielder who is 30 yards away.
But wait! I've just tackled an opponent with perfect timing and position and I've made contact with the ball! Good for me! No, wait...the ball bounced off the attacker's shins for the 984,928th time this match and he still has the ball. Oh, and now he's through on goal.
I was a goal up in a match last night, turned to pass the ball back to my keeper with the nearest opponent being 10 yards away, and my defender missed the ball. He had complete control of it. He took two touches. He was facing the direction of the pass. Then he swung his leg to kick the ball and instead grazed his studs across the top of it. The result was my opponent taking the ball and scoring, unopposed because my defender was now stuck in the "you're telling me to sprint but I decided to stumble instead" animation and couldn't catch up. That was his only goal in a 1-1 draw. In other words, I defended against his skill moves perfectly and shut him out, scored, and still didn't win.
How do I "learn to defend" when the game is so flawed that a 10-yard simple forward-facing pass played by a 99-rated defender with 99 short passing and 99 long passing who has full control of the ball and isn't under any pressure can play out that way?
You can say "learn to defend" as much as you want, but the simple fact is that if both players were playing balanced with 5 depth, the best defensive FIFA player in the world couldn't stop the best attacking FIFA player in the world. It should be 50/50 in that situation, but it's 100/0.
That causes people to drop back. That causes people to pack the penalty area. That causes them to control their CDM and rely on the AI to do the work for them. They try to get an overwhelming numerical advantage while defending, because they know that they can't rely on their own inputs, because their own inputs have a decent chance of failing, so they may as well stick 9 AI-controlled defenders in there who do the job better than they can.
And now you're wanting to extend skilling to beat the drop back?
It'll just make it worse.
In FIFA 19, people hit La Croqueta a hundred times and walked through defences. The "skillers" said "learn to defend."
In FIFA 20, people hit dragback after dragback and fake shot after fake shot and the skillers say "learn to defend."
In FIFA 21, we'll be in a situation between 19 and 20, and when my defender trips over his own shoelaces when running in a straight line and gives up a goal, the skillers will say "learn to defend."
But I have to ask, why should the onus be on the defending team? Why can't the skillers learn to attack without hitting three hundred skill moves in a row? I know the drop back prevents that (to an extent, but not nearly to the level that the whiners complain about) at the moment, but if the game had improved defending and drop back wasn't a thing, skillers would still be complaining that they can't do enough skill moves in a row.
Bla bla, all these skills are just very unrealistic. There is not even a word to describe the unrealness of even being able to chain them. True, it takes skill to master them but this should be a football sim not some Harlem Globetrotters tribute.
I 100% agree with you.
But please see my previous post.
Spamming 3 La Croqueta SHOULDN'T beat anyone who is decent at defending. But it does.
All u did is nothing similar to footbal but volta. Thats the main reason ppl dont want to have skills on the pitch...
And those results are common in football. I rather have those then 4:3, 7:6 etc...
this
One example is people use skills to get a speed boost. I understand some skills are designed to get past the defender quickly. However, there is no skill in the world which gives a speed boost. Skills are designed to confuse the defender not defy the laws of physics.
The usual rules of acceleration (players stats) should still apply on skills. Chaining a certain skill move to make your player super fast should not be a thing.
As per my first line, I am lucky enough to defend most skill moves (conservative defending is the key) and getting lucky every now and again with reading the opponent. Yes chaining was annoying in Fifa 19, but more so for the mechanic issues than the actual skills.
I think the CPU is the other issue. If I am controlling a player, they should not cause a foul unless I have pressed a button to try to tackle or slide. Fifa 20 has been a big improvement on 19 for this aspect thankfully.
You never seen a player do a heel to heel or fake shot before? What is so real unrealistic about them? Messi does the fake shot every game and Cr7 does the lateral heel to heel on the wings.
What kind of football do you watch?
Cagey games are booring and there is little skill gap to it. Video games are meant to be fun, if you want to have a real life football experience then go outside and play football with your my friends.
In Call of Duty if you get shot in the leg, you don't have to go to hospital for surgery and rehabilitate for months, you just hide behind cover for 2 seconds and you are all healed
Never. For years I watch bundesliga I have seen about 10 skills. Never heel2heel of fake shot.
So doing a lot of skills in match is unrealistic.
@Purplejacket if skilling is so much fun to you, then go play VOLTA! Because EA actually made a mode for you and your dragback friends to have some fun. Just seems most people didn’t get what EA did there.
Anyway, it’s clear to me that @Boommaametw3 doesn't understand where the true skillgap is made in a game like FIFA. First of all it’s a football game. FIFA players with amazing tactical awareness, vision and the abillity to control manual passes, shots and tackles. Should get rewarded. But the fact is that heavyly assisted ping pong passers, Dragback noobs and La Crocueta noobs have been the rewarded fifa players in this so called football game.
Exactly THAT is why I went crazy back in the early start of FIFA 18, where manual defending was introduced. Because the results was 8-3, 7-4, and 5-5 every game, as the attacking was so heavyly assisted with passes and shots flying everywere. I was told I couldn’t defend, but when I ask if those exact same people could attack without assists. The were instant silence. Why?
Because all these shushing noobs couldn’t do anything without being assisted in attack.
Today it’s the same problems we have more or less. Balance is key, but there is absolutely no balance in this pathetic game. I defend just fine, and actually love the MANUAL jockey even more because it makes YOU decide and control things. But what is the point if everything else is so heavyly assisted?
I can do all skills with my TOTS Neymar but it doesn’t mean I spam’em every single time he gets the ball. I play football because I love football. Even tho it seems most people just wanna exploit this game with awful looking dragbacks and shush their opponent afterwards.
Why can’t we just play some beautiful football and have fun with that? If normal football isn’t fun to you then go play something else. I mean it’s a football game with authentic atmosphere and licensed stadiums, kits etc. Why can’t we just enjoy the beautiful game for what it is... ?
this reply is the reason why the game is broken and beyond repair. these kind of players thinks when someone complains that automatically make them bad at the game and can't do skill moves.
I've seen a lot of comments here from players about their favorite skill moves and how it gives extra speed boost, extra space, etc..., but when you complaining about that, then you are not elite and this is the only way to beat drop back bla bla bla.
skill moves should never give a speed boost, teleport, or gives an extra undeserved space.
broken skill moves should not be a solution for drop back and AI defending. the solution as people mentioned here is to tune down the AI defending and auto tackles, and reward manual defending. Plus, atacking AI needs to improve and player runs should vary in speed and direction.
the skill in a football game shouldn't be around who does skill moves better. this is the skill gap for FIFA street or Volta.
the skill in FIFA should be around:
1) manually defend with minimum AI assistant (just covering with no auto interception or tackling)
2) when to pass and who to pass to, breaking opponent by passing lanes and having more than one style of play.
3) the ability to read your opponent
4) the ability to choose which pass, shot to perform
5) the ability to know when to speed up the play and when to slow it down.
6) the ability to break down your opponent with passing and LS dribbling like in football.
and for everybody that says it won't be fun if they nerfed the skill moves. then find a different sport to play. if you don't like the actual sport. why do you even play the game ?
weird how the same players that want the game to be skilled base and support skill moves abuse are afraid of manual passing or manual crosses which are the core fundamental of a football game.
after being here in this forum for two years and seeing all kinds of opinions, I think the only solution that EA can come up with to please most of the player base is to create two modes.
1) simulation
2) arcade
I agree that they are easy to perform, and I agree that you should get punished in a way if performed in wrong timing. but what do you mean about rewarded?
I'm only asking because some players think that you should get a speed boost or extra space if performed in the right time.
where I feel that performing a skill move in the right time "where your opponent didn't expect" should reward you without doing any reaction on your opponent's defender.
If he expected it, he should get the ball regardless if I did it in the right time. but If he didn't expect it, my player should be gone without any extra speed boost.