Manchester United Football Club

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  • Kman
    3488 posts National Call-Up
    Keano wrote: »
    Kman wrote: »
    Ahmer50x wrote: »


    That's just about the right take.

    Ole's gonna get pelters if we drop points to West Ham, but I think we need to rest players and chance a few points in the league. I really don't want to go back to the Europa League :joy:

    Does anyone think that it’s an issue he says “maybe” should’ve taken Fred off when in all honesty that should’ve been a definite change to make? It’s these little things that annoy me about Ole and I hope he can work on.

    I mean he's admitted that "maybe" he should've taken him off, the other option which he took was to tel Fred to calm down, stay on his feet which did work for 25 minutes, though I agree he should've been off at HT, when the guys admitted the fault, it's stupid to then try to call them out on that, you're wanting extra blood/issues for no reason imo.

    The difference is the maybe as opposed to “I should have taken him off” that’s the difference
  • Keano
    18225 posts World Class
    Kman wrote: »
    Keano wrote: »
    Kman wrote: »
    Ahmer50x wrote: »


    That's just about the right take.

    Ole's gonna get pelters if we drop points to West Ham, but I think we need to rest players and chance a few points in the league. I really don't want to go back to the Europa League :joy:

    Does anyone think that it’s an issue he says “maybe” should’ve taken Fred off when in all honesty that should’ve been a definite change to make? It’s these little things that annoy me about Ole and I hope he can work on.

    I mean he's admitted that "maybe" he should've taken him off, the other option which he took was to tel Fred to calm down, stay on his feet which did work for 25 minutes, though I agree he should've been off at HT, when the guys admitted the fault, it's stupid to then try to call them out on that, you're wanting extra blood/issues for no reason imo.

    The difference is the maybe as opposed to “I should have taken him off” that’s the difference

    Not much difference, he's admitted fault whilst not opening himself up to the media slamming him for another thing as if they haven't enough, honestly just sounds like you're reactionary wanting someone to blame (which shows in that you're blaming martials for us losing when he had that one chance).

    Subs have been an issue for Ole, Fred should've been subbed off & Cavani prob should've stayed on (though i believe it's managing his minutes) but the other ones have reasons for it.
  • Kman
    3488 posts National Call-Up
    Keano wrote: »
    Kman wrote: »
    Keano wrote: »
    Kman wrote: »
    Ahmer50x wrote: »


    That's just about the right take.

    Ole's gonna get pelters if we drop points to West Ham, but I think we need to rest players and chance a few points in the league. I really don't want to go back to the Europa League :joy:

    Does anyone think that it’s an issue he says “maybe” should’ve taken Fred off when in all honesty that should’ve been a definite change to make? It’s these little things that annoy me about Ole and I hope he can work on.

    I mean he's admitted that "maybe" he should've taken him off, the other option which he took was to tel Fred to calm down, stay on his feet which did work for 25 minutes, though I agree he should've been off at HT, when the guys admitted the fault, it's stupid to then try to call them out on that, you're wanting extra blood/issues for no reason imo.

    The difference is the maybe as opposed to “I should have taken him off” that’s the difference

    Not much difference, he's admitted fault whilst not opening himself up to the media slamming him for another thing as if they haven't enough, honestly just sounds like you're reactionary wanting someone to blame (which shows in that you're blaming martials for us losing when he had that one chance).

    Subs have been an issue for Ole, Fred should've been subbed off & Cavani prob should've stayed on (though i believe it's managing his minutes) but the other ones have reasons for it.

    It’s not reactionary when he quite often makes poor sub choices whether it be the timing, choices of players coming on/off as well as general reading of the game to make the right decision i.e. Fred coming off at HT. This isn’t a one off, hence why it’s worrying. And I understand players miss shots or whatever but Martial is paid to score far more difficult chances than the one presented to him. You can’t honestly say he’s being picked on form atm he’s just there because there’s no other option. I think we’ve turned a corner and have a bit of identity in how we wanna play now and that’s showing in results but I can’t help but feel some mismanagement cost us the game, and that’s on the manager plain and simple.

  • Ahmer50x
    26593 posts Player of the Year
    edited December 2020
    Kman wrote: »
    Keano wrote: »
    Kman wrote: »
    Keano wrote: »
    Kman wrote: »
    Ahmer50x wrote: »


    That's just about the right take.

    Ole's gonna get pelters if we drop points to West Ham, but I think we need to rest players and chance a few points in the league. I really don't want to go back to the Europa League :joy:

    Does anyone think that it’s an issue he says “maybe” should’ve taken Fred off when in all honesty that should’ve been a definite change to make? It’s these little things that annoy me about Ole and I hope he can work on.

    I mean he's admitted that "maybe" he should've taken him off, the other option which he took was to tel Fred to calm down, stay on his feet which did work for 25 minutes, though I agree he should've been off at HT, when the guys admitted the fault, it's stupid to then try to call them out on that, you're wanting extra blood/issues for no reason imo.

    The difference is the maybe as opposed to “I should have taken him off” that’s the difference

    Not much difference, he's admitted fault whilst not opening himself up to the media slamming him for another thing as if they haven't enough, honestly just sounds like you're reactionary wanting someone to blame (which shows in that you're blaming martials for us losing when he had that one chance).

    Subs have been an issue for Ole, Fred should've been subbed off & Cavani prob should've stayed on (though i believe it's managing his minutes) but the other ones have reasons for it.

    It’s not reactionary when he quite often makes poor sub choices whether it be the timing, choices of players coming on/off as well as general reading of the game to make the right decision i.e. Fred coming off at HT. This isn’t a one off, hence why it’s worrying. And I understand players miss shots or whatever but Martial is paid to score far more difficult chances than the one presented to him. You can’t honestly say he’s being picked on form atm he’s just there because there’s no other option. I think we’ve turned a corner and have a bit of identity in how we wanna play now and that’s showing in results but I can’t help but feel some mismanagement cost us the game, and that’s on the manager plain and simple.

    Agree on Martial. On current form, he wouldn't get into the Newcastle United team, let alone the Manchester United team. Been awful since the season started.

    One of the reasons Ole should be moving towards the diamond as the primary formation IMO. You can play Cavani and Rashford together, which shows a lot of promise, and add in VDB, who is much more of a positive force for us atm than Martial or Pogba (though I thought Pogba was good today in his cameo)
  • LAboog4
    1029 posts Professional
    I know it has been discussed over and over on here and everyone is stuck with their own opinions but if United loses to RB and drops to Europa, I do not see the point of sticking with Ole, outside of fans and the club not wanting to go through a new manager rehire again.

    Looking back at match day 11 last season, United had 13 points and was 10th in the standings with a +2 GD. This season Man United has better players than they had to start last season and after 9 matches are 9th in the table with 16 points and 0 GD. Better points difference but basically same in the table, win the two games in hands and if results go their way they can improve but not drastically compared to win Ole took over.

    Is that really enough improvement over a full year to say Ole is improving the club? Slightly better record with much better players.

    I know people say "give him time" but look at other managers who have taken over in the league within the last few seasons and you can see big improvements to their club (Southampton, Spurs, Chelsea, Everton, Leicester) then look at United and you can't really tell the team is playing better now than a year ago at this time.

    This doesn't just go for Ole either but the same with Arteta. If Arsenal are sitting in 15th place in March, I don't see the point of sticking with him. His players are good enough to be top 8 if he can improve tactics.
  • Ashy
    13133 posts Has That Special Something
    Thing is before the group started many said United would struggle to qualify, PSG got to the final last year and have two incredible attackers while Leipzig got to the semi finals last year and have a brilliant young hardworking team and manager. If you were to say going into the last game all 3 would be on 9 points I'd of thought that's probably bang on. Now how the games actually played out it's looks awful losing to the Turkish team.

    United's game in hand in the league if they win takes them to 4th place same points as Chelsea and 2 off Spurs/Liverpool so they are in a decent position there too.
  • Ahmer50x
    26593 posts Player of the Year
    For me, its clear. Unless we're completely outside the realm of reason (13th in March or something like that), we should stick with the manager until the end of the season atleast.

    Since the Spurs debacle, Manchester United have taken the second most points in the league (1 pt less than Spurs). In the year 2020, United are 3rd behind Liverpool and City. We're in decent form broadly speaking. We've been playing decent football. Why on earth would you derail that and go through a midseason change just because we're prone to imploding on ourselves every few matches?

    Lets just see what happens with the FA, EFL, CL/EL cup runs. See how many points we get. Then decide whether to keep going with Ole or not. If we're in the high 60s again, fair enough it hasn't worked. But if we're into the mid 70s, it means we're getting more consistent under current management and that we should back them further.

    I mean, if we win our match, we're 2 points off top spot in the league ffs :joy:
  • Keano
    18225 posts World Class
    Kman wrote: »
    Keano wrote: »
    Kman wrote: »
    Keano wrote: »
    Kman wrote: »
    Ahmer50x wrote: »


    That's just about the right take.

    Ole's gonna get pelters if we drop points to West Ham, but I think we need to rest players and chance a few points in the league. I really don't want to go back to the Europa League :joy:

    Does anyone think that it’s an issue he says “maybe” should’ve taken Fred off when in all honesty that should’ve been a definite change to make? It’s these little things that annoy me about Ole and I hope he can work on.

    I mean he's admitted that "maybe" he should've taken him off, the other option which he took was to tel Fred to calm down, stay on his feet which did work for 25 minutes, though I agree he should've been off at HT, when the guys admitted the fault, it's stupid to then try to call them out on that, you're wanting extra blood/issues for no reason imo.

    The difference is the maybe as opposed to “I should have taken him off” that’s the difference

    Not much difference, he's admitted fault whilst not opening himself up to the media slamming him for another thing as if they haven't enough, honestly just sounds like you're reactionary wanting someone to blame (which shows in that you're blaming martials for us losing when he had that one chance).

    Subs have been an issue for Ole, Fred should've been subbed off & Cavani prob should've stayed on (though i believe it's managing his minutes) but the other ones have reasons for it.

    It’s not reactionary when he quite often makes poor sub choices whether it be the timing, choices of players coming on/off as well as general reading of the game to make the right decision i.e. Fred coming off at HT. This isn’t a one off, hence why it’s worrying. And I understand players miss shots or whatever but Martial is paid to score far more difficult chances than the one presented to him. You can’t honestly say he’s being picked on form atm he’s just there because there’s no other option. I think we’ve turned a corner and have a bit of identity in how we wanna play now and that’s showing in results but I can’t help but feel some mismanagement cost us the game, and that’s on the manager plain and simple.

    I disagree, he has made poor subs but has been improving, the lapse in judgement is obvious a concern but you'r enot going to go from what he was to perfct overnight. Sure he's paid more to finish much more, but that's being called human, you might score a screamer & then miss a sitter, if we sacked off everyone who's mised a sitter you'd not have anymore players, everyone misses them, should martial have scored? is it his fault we lost? No, that's 100% reactionary of you (and a way OTT statement). he's not being picked on form, but he was picked tonight to do a job, help us on the counter & break through PSG, which for the most part the team did great with., would I have played Martial tonight? @Apollo & @Ahmer50x will know I said to play Cavani & rashford up top, but martial playing did fit into what Ole wanted to do & caused them issues.

    I mean 90% of what he did was correct & did well, so more so than blaming Ole (though as I said, i believed Fred should've come off & called for it), Fred should be the one to blame as 1. You should know you never put your head in, let alone push it forward in that instance, secondly... everything is in video now, you won't get away with it & thirdly, you're on a yellow, should really be sent off... stay on your feet & don't give the ref a chance to send you off (even more so when you have a playacting team like PSG who will fall over & surround the ref at any chance).
  • Kman
    3488 posts National Call-Up
    edited December 2020
    Keano wrote: »
    Kman wrote: »
    Keano wrote: »
    Kman wrote: »
    Keano wrote: »
    Kman wrote: »
    Ahmer50x wrote: »


    That's just about the right take.

    Ole's gonna get pelters if we drop points to West Ham, but I think we need to rest players and chance a few points in the league. I really don't want to go back to the Europa League :joy:

    Does anyone think that it’s an issue he says “maybe” should’ve taken Fred off when in all honesty that should’ve been a definite change to make? It’s these little things that annoy me about Ole and I hope he can work on.

    I mean he's admitted that "maybe" he should've taken him off, the other option which he took was to tel Fred to calm down, stay on his feet which did work for 25 minutes, though I agree he should've been off at HT, when the guys admitted the fault, it's stupid to then try to call them out on that, you're wanting extra blood/issues for no reason imo.

    The difference is the maybe as opposed to “I should have taken him off” that’s the difference

    Not much difference, he's admitted fault whilst not opening himself up to the media slamming him for another thing as if they haven't enough, honestly just sounds like you're reactionary wanting someone to blame (which shows in that you're blaming martials for us losing when he had that one chance).

    Subs have been an issue for Ole, Fred should've been subbed off & Cavani prob should've stayed on (though i believe it's managing his minutes) but the other ones have reasons for it.

    It’s not reactionary when he quite often makes poor sub choices whether it be the timing, choices of players coming on/off as well as general reading of the game to make the right decision i.e. Fred coming off at HT. This isn’t a one off, hence why it’s worrying. And I understand players miss shots or whatever but Martial is paid to score far more difficult chances than the one presented to him. You can’t honestly say he’s being picked on form atm he’s just there because there’s no other option. I think we’ve turned a corner and have a bit of identity in how we wanna play now and that’s showing in results but I can’t help but feel some mismanagement cost us the game, and that’s on the manager plain and simple.

    I disagree, he has made poor subs but has been improving, the lapse in judgement is obvious a concern but you'r enot going to go from what he was to perfct overnight. Sure he's paid more to finish much more, but that's being called human, you might score a screamer & then miss a sitter, if we sacked off everyone who's mised a sitter you'd not have anymore players, everyone misses them, should martial have scored? is it his fault we lost? No, that's 100% reactionary of you (and a way OTT statement). he's not being picked on form, but he was picked tonight to do a job, help us on the counter & break through PSG, which for the most part the team did great with., would I have played Martial tonight? @Apollo & @Ahmer50x will know I said to play Cavani & rashford up top, but martial playing did fit into what Ole wanted to do & caused them issues.

    I mean 90% of what he did was correct & did well, so more so than blaming Ole (though as I said, i believed Fred should've come off & called for it), Fred should be the one to blame as 1. You should know you never put your head in, let alone push it forward in that instance, secondly... everything is in video now, you won't get away with it & thirdly, you're on a yellow, should really be sent off... stay on your feet & don't give the ref a chance to send you off (even more so when you have a playacting team like PSG who will fall over & surround the ref at any chance).

    Of course Fred is to blame doing any of that stuff was dumb..but Ole had the power to replace him at halftime (after we were gifted a second chance for him not being given a straight red) and have us push on for a result. Everything went to crap after Fred was sent off second half. I guess we agree to disagree because for me, the manager should’ve done better.

    And on Martial, he played a decent game but like I said, outside of changing the formation there’s no one that would start ahead of him (due to our lack of quality in a winger role). How many goals has Martial got since the start of the season?
  • Pietu
    7949 posts League Winner
    Looking at the Xg, you can't be too disappointed, Psg deserved it and they are a good team so no shame in losing to them.
  • SimenHP
    2981 posts National Call-Up
    Ahmer50x wrote: »
    For me, its clear. Unless we're completely outside the realm of reason (13th in March or something like that), we should stick with the manager until the end of the season atleast.

    Since the Spurs debacle, Manchester United have taken the second most points in the league (1 pt less than Spurs). In the year 2020, United are 3rd behind Liverpool and City. We're in decent form broadly speaking. We've been playing decent football. Why on earth would you derail that and go through a midseason change just because we're prone to imploding on ourselves every few matches?

    Lets just see what happens with the FA, EFL, CL/EL cup runs. See how many points we get. Then decide whether to keep going with Ole or not. If we're in the high 60s again, fair enough it hasn't worked. But if we're into the mid 70s, it means we're getting more consistent under current management and that we should back them further.

    I mean, if we win our match, we're 2 points off top spot in the league ffs :joy:

    Changing the manager might not be the best idea. Just look at Lampard, at the end of last season and the start of this season a big part of our fan base (Chelsea) wanted Lampard out because we didn't see any improvement, but after the new signings came in (especially Mendy, who imo was the best signing any team did in the summer window after how much he changed our whole defense) and in current form we might be the best team (or atleast top 5) in the world.

    So I think the best thing to do, would ofcourse be to change Ed Woodward to someone better. But if that won't happend you need to atleast buy a better defender, because if you ask me none of the MU defenders, except for maybe AWB and Telles are good enough. Maguire is just as bad as Kepa value wise if you ask me, with what he offers he shouldn't cost more than $15m at most .
  • Keano
    18225 posts World Class
    Pietu wrote: »
    Looking at the Xg, you can't be too disappointed, Psg deserved it and they are a good team so no shame in losing to them.

    I mean, they deserved a draw at best, us being the better team even after going down to 10, but alright pal.
  • Snugglebites
    2200 posts Fans' Favourite
    Smile! Sing a little, laugh a little, I love you!
  • Keano
    18225 posts World Class
    Smile! Sing a little, laugh a little, I love you!

    😂
  • Ahmer50x
    26593 posts Player of the Year
    edited December 2020


    This is brilliant 😂

    “ Solskjær has been more heavily criticised for leaving Fred on the field than Mikel Arteta, the tactically sophisticated, in-his-depth manager of the Premier League’s 14th-placed team, was for allowing David Luiz to stagger round like a Basil Fawlty tribute for 40 minutes at the Emirates on Sunday. And the shame just keeps piling up for Solskjær and United. In the Premier League, even if they win their game in hand at Burnley, they will still be behind Frank Lampard’s champions-elect on goal difference. Had Solskjær done his job properly, United would be six points clear at the top with a game in hand, defending their record-breaking 2019-20 title win in style.”
  • Stlducks
    4430 posts National Call-Up
    Who the hell calls Arteta "tactically sophisticated"? The biggest issue with Arteta is he is stubborn with tactics. Check out the Arsenal thread and you see them talk about it every game. lol what a horrible article.

    "Defend Ole because his dumb decisions are not as bad as this other guys"
  • Ahmer50x
    26593 posts Player of the Year
    How would you guys approach West Ham? I wouldn't risk anybody and honestly I'd readily take the L here to boost our chances of getting something off Leipzig.
    Henderson
    AWB---Lindelof---Maguire---Telles
    McT
    Fred---Pogba
    Mata
    Greenwood---Martial

    I don't expect Ole to give Bruno the night off but I would.

    Happy to gamble with the 3 points by standing down our three best attackers in Bruno, Rashford, Cavani. I know we might actually win the Europa League but I really really don't want to go back there :joy:
  • Keano
    18225 posts World Class
    Ahmer50x wrote: »
    How would you guys approach West Ham? I wouldn't risk anybody and honestly I'd readily take the L here to boost our chances of getting something off Leipzig.
    Henderson
    AWB---Lindelof---Maguire---Telles
    McT
    Fred---Pogba
    Mata
    Greenwood---Martial

    I don't expect Ole to give Bruno the night off but I would.

    Happy to gamble with the 3 points by standing down our three best attackers in Bruno, Rashford, Cavani. I know we might actually win the Europa League but I really really don't want to go back there :joy:

    I know we spoke about this previous & I think that was roughly what we agreed on, given VDb will be perfect against a pressing team of Leipzigs quality, Pogba needing minutes & not being a starter, Fred bring suspended & Dave seemingly carrying an injury. Cavani & rashford being the preferred attackers with Bruno behind against Leipzig too (Martials out of form & Cavani's done well since he came so deserves the priority, which is Leipzig).
  • Stlducks
    4430 posts National Call-Up
    West Ham actually have a pretty good record against you guys in recent years and their record at home this year is really good. Bruno is going to have to sit at some point but I think he can play through and sit after the City game until Leeds. Missing the Sheffield United game.

    Maybe take him off early against West Ham or only give him a half but without him I can see it being a struggle to score.
  • Keano
    18225 posts World Class
    UM4R wrote: »

    Loves those kind of chats Woodward does, you’d think he was a celeb the amount he gets about in the media compared to other clubs people at his level.
  • Stlducks
    4430 posts National Call-Up
    Probably not what United fans want to hear but Woodward has a point with this comment.

    "I told this forum back in April that we remained committed to strengthening the squad, while being disciplined in our spending during the pandemic. I believe we've delivered on that, with the additions we made during the summer taking our total net spending to over €200m since summer 2019 - more than any other major European club over that period.

    We will continue to support Ole with a planned, long-term approach to recruitment, focused on the summer windows."

    They have backed Ole and by the sounds of it, Woodward does not plan on winter signings.
  • Teh Zombz
    4669 posts National Call-Up
    when do we play our game in hand?
  • Stlducks
    4430 posts National Call-Up
    Teh Zombz wrote: »
    when do we play our game in hand?

    One pod I listened to said games in hand will be made up depending when teams are knocked out of cups. They will try fitting it in during a cup round if both teams are out. If not, a late midweek game when European matches are not played is the next option.
  • Ahmer50x
    26593 posts Player of the Year
    Teh Zombz wrote: »
    when do we play our game in hand?

    Last I read, it'll be during the one week "midseason break". We just won't get one.
  • Stlducks
    4430 posts National Call-Up
    Ahmer50x wrote: »
    Teh Zombz wrote: »
    when do we play our game in hand?

    Last I read, it'll be during the one week "midseason break". We just won't get one.

    During an episode on Zonal Marking I thought they said that idea was scratched because having a midseason break is required by the league in their agreement with clubs. That is why they were going to schedule it on a weekend during FA cup or midweek after the EFL cup. But who knows with how this year has been. They expected Spurs to play Sat-Tue-Thur-Sun one week earlier in the year so I doubt the league cares at this point.
  • UM4R
    4432 posts Moderator
    edited December 2020
    Pellistri had another good game for the reserves tonight, that us Ole's comment about him earlier. Hope he gets some minutes over the Christmas period.

    Especially as no one has impressed at RW for us this season (or any for the last 5 :D:D)
  • Teh Zombz
    4669 posts National Call-Up
    UM4R wrote: »
    Pellistri had another good game for the reserves tonight, that us Ole's comment about him earlier. Hope he gets some minutes over the Christmas period.

    Especially as no one has impressed at RW for us this season (or any for the last 5 :D:D)

    yep after his awful first game he has looked quite good, been watching the youth a lot lately and shola shoretire looks like a good prospect
  • Ahmer50x
    26593 posts Player of the Year


    4231:
    Henderson
    AWB---Lindelof---Maguire---Telles
    McT---Pogba
    Greenwood---VDB---Martial
    Cavani

    Not a bad team. I would've rested Cavani for Leipzig but otherwise quite happy.
  • Keano
    18225 posts World Class
    Ahmer50x wrote: »


    4231:
    Henderson
    AWB---Lindelof---Maguire---Telles
    McT---Pogba
    Greenwood---VDB---Martial
    Cavani

    Not a bad team. I would've rested Cavani for Leipzig but otherwise quite happy.

    Hope VDB can shine today and martial/greenwood can get some form.
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