Manchester United Football Club

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  • XxRichiexRichxX
    30501 posts National Team Captain
    Ahmer50x wrote: »
    I wasn’t trying to do a detailed analysis of how each club got into its mess.

    The main point was to highlight similarities between Ole and Gattuso, as well as the desire to stuff ex players into senior management roles.

    I suppose. But it's hard to ignore the financial state they are in and they are struggling to get out of it...where as OGS will have the finances to fix the issues. It's going to be difficult and probably not the targets that we or he may primarily want due to UCL, but still.
  • Ahmer50x
    13778 posts Has That Special Something
    Ahmer50x wrote: »
    I wasn’t trying to do a detailed analysis of how each club got into its mess.

    The main point was to highlight similarities between Ole and Gattuso, as well as the desire to stuff ex players into senior management roles.

    I suppose. But it's hard to ignore the financial state they are in and they are struggling to get out of it...where as OGS will have the finances to fix the issues. It's going to be difficult and probably not the targets that we or he may primarily want due to UCL, but still.

    Gattuso spent 100m euro last summer. Not United level money but not bad for Serie A.

    Likewise, Montella spent 150m euro the year before.

    While United are obviously far richer and Ole will be backed more, I still expect that, like Milan, we’ll be fighting for top 4 till the end and Ole’s future will be speculated on more than once.
  • Pietu
    699 posts An Exciting Prospect
    Ahmer50x wrote: »
    I wasn’t trying to do a detailed analysis of how each club got into its mess.

    The main point was to highlight similarities between Ole and Gattuso, as well as the desire to stuff ex players into senior management roles.

    Leonardo like you said has experience and he is actually good and Maldini should have connections, he is the GOAT defender and he is Milan through and through.

    They are looking at Conte and Sarri as Gattuso replacement but Rino could continue if they get top 4.
  • Apollo
    10487 posts Has That Special Something
    It'd be nice if we could have a bit of confirmed news this week please Ed, give us fans at least a semblance of hope that you can deliver the rebuild that Ole wants by getting things started. 😬
  • Retro_G
    26720 posts Player of the Year
    Apollo wrote: »
    It'd be nice if we could have a bit of confirmed news this week please Ed, give us fans at least a semblance of hope that you can deliver the rebuild that Ole wants by getting things started. 😬

    Italian league still isn't finished, bet we won't see any big signings until after the champions league.
  • Apollo
    10487 posts Has That Special Something
    edited May 20
    Retro_G wrote: »
    Apollo wrote: »
    It'd be nice if we could have a bit of confirmed news this week please Ed, give us fans at least a semblance of hope that you can deliver the rebuild that Ole wants by getting things started. 😬

    Italian league still isn't finished, bet we won't see any big signings until after the champions league.

    I wouldn't be surprised if you're right regarding that second part, but it's frustrating if that's the case. Like for example, I highly doubt that none of our targets are PL players, most of their season's are finished. Just using the example of a player we've actually been linked with to make my point, say AWB is one of the targets - what's stopping Ed and going out and getting that deal done first? It gets one over the line and if he completed a few deals early (whether that's players incoming or outgoing), it says to those targets that we have to wait to try and get that the club are serious about the rebuild.
  • Retro_G
    26720 posts Player of the Year
    Ahmer50x wrote: »
    Ahmer50x wrote: »
    I wasn’t trying to do a detailed analysis of how each club got into its mess.

    The main point was to highlight similarities between Ole and Gattuso, as well as the desire to stuff ex players into senior management roles.

    I suppose. But it's hard to ignore the financial state they are in and they are struggling to get out of it...where as OGS will have the finances to fix the issues. It's going to be difficult and probably not the targets that we or he may primarily want due to UCL, but still.

    Gattuso spent 100m euro last summer. Not United level money but not bad for Serie A.

    Likewise, Montella spent 150m euro the year before.

    While United are obviously far richer and Ole will be backed more, I still expect that, like Milan, we’ll be fighting for top 4 till the end and Ole’s future will be speculated on more than once.

    We don't know how much Ole will be backed over a long time period. Let's say Ole gets us top 4 next season, will the Glazers spend big again next summer? Doubtful, look at what happened after we finished second under Josè.
  • Retro_G
    26720 posts Player of the Year
    Apollo wrote: »

    65 million is a steal.
  • Apollo
    10487 posts Has That Special Something
    Retro_G wrote: »
    Apollo wrote: »

    65 million is a steal.

    Yep. Sounds ridiculous to say given the amount, but in this current market that's a hell of a deal for Barca.
  • Retro_G
    26720 posts Player of the Year
    Apollo wrote: »
    Retro_G wrote: »
    Apollo wrote: »
    It'd be nice if we could have a bit of confirmed news this week please Ed, give us fans at least a semblance of hope that you can deliver the rebuild that Ole wants by getting things started. 😬

    Italian league still isn't finished, bet we won't see any big signings until after the champions league.

    I wouldn't be surprised if you're right regarding that second part, but it's frustrating if that's the case. Like for example, I highly doubt that none of our targets are PL players, most of their season's are finished. Just using the example of a player we've actually been linked with to make my point, say AWB is one of the targets - what's stopping Ed and going out and getting that deal done first? It gets one over the line and if he completed a few deals early (whether that's players incoming or outgoing), it says to those targets that we have to wait to try and get that the club are serious about the rebuild.

    I'm sure AWB would've a few offers on the table, probably his agent holding up the deal. He will look for the best possible transfer.
  • Apollo
    10487 posts Has That Special Something
    Retro_G wrote: »
    Apollo wrote: »
    Retro_G wrote: »
    Apollo wrote: »
    It'd be nice if we could have a bit of confirmed news this week please Ed, give us fans at least a semblance of hope that you can deliver the rebuild that Ole wants by getting things started. 😬

    Italian league still isn't finished, bet we won't see any big signings until after the champions league.

    I wouldn't be surprised if you're right regarding that second part, but it's frustrating if that's the case. Like for example, I highly doubt that none of our targets are PL players, most of their season's are finished. Just using the example of a player we've actually been linked with to make my point, say AWB is one of the targets - what's stopping Ed and going out and getting that deal done first? It gets one over the line and if he completed a few deals early (whether that's players incoming or outgoing), it says to those targets that we have to wait to try and get that the club are serious about the rebuild.

    I'm sure AWB would've a few offers on the table, probably his agent holding up the deal. He will look for the best possible transfer.

    Probably, but he was just an example. Woodward should not be waiting until after the CL before conducting any business
  • Retro_G
    26720 posts Player of the Year
    Apollo wrote: »
    Retro_G wrote: »
    Apollo wrote: »

    65 million is a steal.

    Yep. Sounds ridiculous to say given the amount, but in this current market that's a hell of a deal for Barca.

    Koulibaly it's then, I'd give him the captains armband.
  • Apollo
    10487 posts Has That Special Something
    Retro_G wrote: »
    Apollo wrote: »
    Retro_G wrote: »
    Apollo wrote: »

    65 million is a steal.

    Yep. Sounds ridiculous to say given the amount, but in this current market that's a hell of a deal for Barca.

    Koulibaly it's then, I'd give him the captains armband.

    I would too tbh. He's the leader in defence we desperately need. Lindelof VC.
  • Retro_G
    26720 posts Player of the Year
    Apollo wrote: »
    Retro_G wrote: »
    Apollo wrote: »
    Retro_G wrote: »
    Apollo wrote: »
    It'd be nice if we could have a bit of confirmed news this week please Ed, give us fans at least a semblance of hope that you can deliver the rebuild that Ole wants by getting things started. 😬

    Italian league still isn't finished, bet we won't see any big signings until after the champions league.

    I wouldn't be surprised if you're right regarding that second part, but it's frustrating if that's the case. Like for example, I highly doubt that none of our targets are PL players, most of their season's are finished. Just using the example of a player we've actually been linked with to make my point, say AWB is one of the targets - what's stopping Ed and going out and getting that deal done first? It gets one over the line and if he completed a few deals early (whether that's players incoming or outgoing), it says to those targets that we have to wait to try and get that the club are serious about the rebuild.

    I'm sure AWB would've a few offers on the table, probably his agent holding up the deal. He will look for the best possible transfer.

    Probably, but he was just an example. Woodward should not be waiting until after the CL before conducting any business

    Agreed mate, Ed should've been working on deals months ago.
  • Pxul_
    7115 posts Big Money Move
    Would you guys not be interested in De Vrig?

    He seems like a leader that could help and would be cheaper than koulibaly?
  • Low Ki
    11436 posts Has That Special Something
    You dont give the new big signing the captain's armband without earning it.....
  • Retro_G
    26720 posts Player of the Year
    Low Ki wrote: »
    You dont give the new big signing the captain's armband without earning it.....

    Normally I'd agree with you, but our squad is clearly lacking leadership. Koulibaly is already one of Napoli's captains, he is a vocal commanding presence. If we sign Koulibaly, he has a strong pre-season leading by example. I'd give him the armband, it's not unheard of for players to sign, become captains relatively soon. Didn't Robbie Keane get the armband at Spurs, right after they signed him from Liverpool?
  • Retro_G
    26720 posts Player of the Year
    Pxul_ wrote: »
    Would you guys not be interested in De Vrig?

    He seems like a leader that could help and would be cheaper than koulibaly?

    I haven't seen enough of De Vrig. I've been going out of my way to watch Napoli games this season and Koulibaly is a monster at the back.
  • Retro_G
    26720 posts Player of the Year
    Balague saying it's between Barca, Juventus for De Ligt.

  • XxRichiexRichxX
    30501 posts National Team Captain
    Apollo wrote: »
    It'd be nice if we could have a bit of confirmed news this week please Ed, give us fans at least a semblance of hope that you can deliver the rebuild that Ole wants by getting things started. 😬

    TBH, a lot of the "urgency" of signing players this summer is going to likely fall on the players/agent. Without UCL, decisions aren't going come easy for players unless we are shoveling money at them, which we've pretty much all agreed we need to get away from.
  • Retro_G
    26720 posts Player of the Year
    Apollo wrote: »
    It'd be nice if we could have a bit of confirmed news this week please Ed, give us fans at least a semblance of hope that you can deliver the rebuild that Ole wants by getting things started. 😬

    TBH, a lot of the "urgency" of signing players this summer is going to likely fall on the players/agent. Without UCL, decisions aren't going come easy for players unless we are shoveling money at them, which we've pretty much all agreed we need to get away from.

    I'd shovel money at Koulibaly or De Ligt.
  • Kellnerr
    2157 posts Fans' Favourite
    Retro_G wrote: »
    Didn't Robbie Keane get the armband at Spurs, right after they signed him from Liverpool?

    Keane already was Spurs captain though, before he left for only half of the season.

  • Apollo
    10487 posts Has That Special Something
    edited May 20
    Apollo wrote: »
    It'd be nice if we could have a bit of confirmed news this week please Ed, give us fans at least a semblance of hope that you can deliver the rebuild that Ole wants by getting things started. 😬

    TBH, a lot of the "urgency" of signing players this summer is going to likely fall on the players/agent. Without UCL, decisions aren't going come easy for players unless we are shoveling money at them, which we've pretty much all agreed we need to get away from.

    As far as big name players are concerned, I'd agree with you. There are plenty of players around though that would improve us that aren't big name players, that we should be able to sign without shovelling money at them. I don't think there's an excuse for not getting some business done early in the window. As we've all established, not every signing has to be a big name, Ole wants younger players who will be at the club long term. I find it hard to believe that we wouldn't be able to sign some players like that early in the window.
  • XxRichiexRichxX
    30501 posts National Team Captain
    Retro_G wrote: »
    Ahmer50x wrote: »
    Ahmer50x wrote: »
    I wasn’t trying to do a detailed analysis of how each club got into its mess.

    The main point was to highlight similarities between Ole and Gattuso, as well as the desire to stuff ex players into senior management roles.

    I suppose. But it's hard to ignore the financial state they are in and they are struggling to get out of it...where as OGS will have the finances to fix the issues. It's going to be difficult and probably not the targets that we or he may primarily want due to UCL, but still.

    Gattuso spent 100m euro last summer. Not United level money but not bad for Serie A.

    Likewise, Montella spent 150m euro the year before.

    While United are obviously far richer and Ole will be backed more, I still expect that, like Milan, we’ll be fighting for top 4 till the end and Ole’s future will be speculated on more than once.

    We don't know how much Ole will be backed over a long time period. Let's say Ole gets us top 4 next season, will the Glazers spend big again next summer? Doubtful, look at what happened after we finished second under Josè.

    Yes but look what happened when we won the EL...we spent more than we did in his first window.

    You're using one window to convince yourself that the board will stop backing him...and you're ignoring key factors like the fact that in the final 2-3 months of his 2nd season, results started to slip and the public drama between Mourinho and Pogba/squad, etc. There are a number of factors that could have contributing to them not wanting to buy him a CB.
    Retro_G wrote: »
    Pxul_ wrote: »
    Would you guys not be interested in De Vrig?

    He seems like a leader that could help and would be cheaper than koulibaly?

    I haven't seen enough of De Vrig. I've been going out of my way to watch Napoli games this season and Koulibaly is a monster at the back.

    I assume you guys are talking about De Vrij, not Vrig
  • XxRichiexRichxX
    30501 posts National Team Captain
    Retro_G wrote: »
    Apollo wrote: »
    It'd be nice if we could have a bit of confirmed news this week please Ed, give us fans at least a semblance of hope that you can deliver the rebuild that Ole wants by getting things started. 😬

    TBH, a lot of the "urgency" of signing players this summer is going to likely fall on the players/agent. Without UCL, decisions aren't going come easy for players unless we are shoveling money at them, which we've pretty much all agreed we need to get away from.

    I'd shovel money at Koulibaly or De Ligt.

    Both of those would be the exception for me as well, but we still don't need to be offering Alexis money in terms of overpayment.
  • Sellish
    8226 posts League Winner
    Retro_G wrote: »
    Apollo wrote: »
    It'd be nice if we could have a bit of confirmed news this week please Ed, give us fans at least a semblance of hope that you can deliver the rebuild that Ole wants by getting things started. 😬

    TBH, a lot of the "urgency" of signing players this summer is going to likely fall on the players/agent. Without UCL, decisions aren't going come easy for players unless we are shoveling money at them, which we've pretty much all agreed we need to get away from.

    I'd shovel money at Koulibaly or De Ligt.

    Both of those would be the exception for me as well, but we still don't need to be offering Alexis money in terms of overpayment.

    De Ligt would be one of the few players in the world I would give Alexis money if I had to.
    Him, Mbappe & De Gea probably.
  • XxRichiexRichxX
    30501 posts National Team Captain
    Apollo wrote: »
    Apollo wrote: »
    It'd be nice if we could have a bit of confirmed news this week please Ed, give us fans at least a semblance of hope that you can deliver the rebuild that Ole wants by getting things started. 😬

    TBH, a lot of the "urgency" of signing players this summer is going to likely fall on the players/agent. Without UCL, decisions aren't going come easy for players unless we are shoveling money at them, which we've pretty much all agreed we need to get away from.

    As far as big name players are concerned, I'd agree with you. There are plenty of players around though that would improve us that aren't big name players, that we should be able to sign without shovelling money at them. I don't think there's an excuse for not getting some business done early in the window. As we've all established, not every signing has to be a big name, Ole wants younger players who will be at the club long term. I find it hard to believe that we wouldn't be able to sign some players like that early in the window.

    Yeah I agree. I'm just simply trying to say that there's gotta be a little patience because I'm sure Ed's going to be working for the primary targets of OGS, and most of those targets want UCL. And I genuinely can't see us buying a bunch of "smaller" players as well as the primary targets.
  • XxRichiexRichxX
    30501 posts National Team Captain
    Sellish wrote: »
    Retro_G wrote: »
    Apollo wrote: »
    It'd be nice if we could have a bit of confirmed news this week please Ed, give us fans at least a semblance of hope that you can deliver the rebuild that Ole wants by getting things started. 😬

    TBH, a lot of the "urgency" of signing players this summer is going to likely fall on the players/agent. Without UCL, decisions aren't going come easy for players unless we are shoveling money at them, which we've pretty much all agreed we need to get away from.

    I'd shovel money at Koulibaly or De Ligt.

    Both of those would be the exception for me as well, but we still don't need to be offering Alexis money in terms of overpayment.

    De Ligt would be one of the few players in the world I would give Alexis money if I had to.
    Him, Mbappe & De Gea probably.

    200K P/W max for De Ligt... wayyyyyyyyy too many risks for overpaying a player of his age.

    seems a dead argument regarding De ligt though as he appears to be all but confirmed to be off to Barca at this point.
  • Apollo
    10487 posts Has That Special Something
    edited May 20
    Apollo wrote: »
    Apollo wrote: »
    It'd be nice if we could have a bit of confirmed news this week please Ed, give us fans at least a semblance of hope that you can deliver the rebuild that Ole wants by getting things started. 😬

    TBH, a lot of the "urgency" of signing players this summer is going to likely fall on the players/agent. Without UCL, decisions aren't going come easy for players unless we are shoveling money at them, which we've pretty much all agreed we need to get away from.

    As far as big name players are concerned, I'd agree with you. There are plenty of players around though that would improve us that aren't big name players, that we should be able to sign without shovelling money at them. I don't think there's an excuse for not getting some business done early in the window. As we've all established, not every signing has to be a big name, Ole wants younger players who will be at the club long term. I find it hard to believe that we wouldn't be able to sign some players like that early in the window.

    Yeah I agree. I'm just simply trying to say that there's gotta be a little patience because I'm sure Ed's going to be working for the primary targets of OGS, and most of those targets want UCL. And I genuinely can't see us buying a bunch of "smaller" players as well as the primary targets.

    I completely agree that there needs to be some patience, but there is a balance to be struck between patience and the amount of work that needs to be done to achieve a rebuild in time for the squad to have a proper pre-season together. If Woodward can ease some of that workload by getting the comparatively easier deals over the line earlier on, then that has to be a good thing. Anyone expecting the club to announce the signing of Koulibaly (if we're even in for him) this early is foolish, deals like that take time, but its not unreasonable to suggest that signings like the backup LW that James would be, should be done early in the window.

    (Hence why I said if we could get something confirmed in the coming week ;) )
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