I hope the final build is slow!

Comments

  • Benja190782
    1418 posts Play-Off Hero
    Its a game
    It should be fun
    We aint playing chess here

    No we aint playing chess, but we aint playing football either.

    We are playing, “who can do most exploits as fast as possible”.

    Take the assists out and watch a beautiful game of football, where skills are actually needed as a fifa player.
  • Thefranchise92
    3743 posts National Call-Up
    I dont get it. If your so good and would be even with manual controls. Why arent you now? Surely everyone has the same assists so whats your excuse there?

    @Thefranchise92 How on earth can you not understand that every single fifa player in this World is assisted with passing, shooting, and crossing. (crossing is on semi-assisted tho)
    Which means that every input from you as a player is being corrected in therms of accuracy and power to HELP you hit your target, whether it’s a goal or a teammate.

    EVERYTHING is assisted, so it takes absolutely NO skill what so ever from you as a fifa player. You are not in control of anything. You simply just spam the passing button as fast as you can, and it doesn’t matter how accurate you are. The assists will always help you.

    While Orison and many other people are proudly smashing the button trying to exploit the passing mechanics as much as possible, and simply ping pong the ball from defence to attack in less than 3 seconds. Just to do another exploit as the 180 degree blind first time shot is done.

    I’m sitting on the other side and thinking, you wouldn’t be able to do that if the game didn’t assisted you with that passing and shooting. It doesn’t take skills to do what these people are doing. It takes knowledge of how to exploit the mechanics yes. But we all know with the help from youtube.

    So what this is all about is. I’m playing football in a football game, while others like Orison are trying to get the most out of the exploits and is focused on everything else but football.

    What makes me frustrated about this is, I’m not trying to do exploits, I’m trying to play football. Meanwhile Orison and the other frantic ping pong passers are rewarded for doing as much exploits as possible and as quickly as possible.

    How on earth is this fair by any means?

    If we can’t play football and get rewarded for it, what are we doing then?

    Take the assists off these less skilled players and watch them fall all the way down to division 10.
    They can’t figure out how to outsmart their opponents, by other things than exploits.

    Tell them about vision/composure, tactical awareness as a fifa player and they simply won’t understand it.

    Yeah so i dont get it. If everyone can do it. How are there people that are consitently the best or better. Were all in the same boat.
    Manual controls are just like any new additions. People would just learn to use it
  • Thefranchise92
    3743 posts National Call-Up
    Orison wrote: »
    Its a game
    It should be fun
    We aint playing chess here

    The guy would be horrible at chess tbf. Every opponent and every game of chess is a bit different meanwhile this guy wouldn't want to adapt to what's in front of him and wouldn't be happy about anything his opponent would do. He would just sit there and moan about the lack of skill on using the queen, because she could go in too many directions. The real skill should be to manually move your pawns.

    🤣🤣🤣🤣 funniest **** you've ever said. Also if it was pro chess with a timer he would complain that he needs 10 minutes to think of what he's doing. Also if you went backwards your playing drop back chess
  • Thefranchise92
    3743 posts National Call-Up
    Orison wrote: »
    Feels good tbf. Winning is always better than losing.

    The only problem is, you didn’t win.

    EA did as they were playing the game for you.

    Take away the assists, so you won’t be able to exploit broken game mechanics like ping pong passing and you are done. Completely done.
    You said yourself you can’t brake a defence down even on assisted passing, if the opponent sits back. Imagine how bad you would be if you were to control every exact input yourself?

    It’s like you are playing a racing game against me with Stability Control, and Traction Control turned on. Then you come proudly over to me after the race to tell me how bad I am, only to realise my car didn’t have Stability Control and Traction Control turned on. I was racing with pure skills while you needed the assists to win.

    Sure it’s something to be proud about. LOOOL!

    Get a grip man. Learn to play football.

    So you admit if it was all manual you would play drop back ptb
  • Benja190782
    1418 posts Play-Off Hero
    Orison wrote: »
    But you are playing on assisted as well. It's like when everybody got traction control on and you win the race.

    Your logic is flawed, because nobody is using manual controls in Fifa.

    No nobody is using manual controls. But wouldn’t it be fun to see how good people really are when they are on their own and not assisted? Wouldn’t it be fun to see who the REALLY good fifa players are?

    The people that doesn’t use exploits to win, but instead use their football brain to win!
    Wouldn’t it be more fair to let the best virtual football players win if they showed some actual skill on their own?

    Instead of letting a bunch of assisted ping pong noobs get rewarded for doing exploits?

    How about that, Orison? Huh?

  • Benja190782
    1418 posts Play-Off Hero
    So you admit if it was all manual you would play drop back ptb

    No I was simply showing Orison that it’s not hard to brake a defence down by pure vision and tactical awareness, even tho you face an opponent that park the bus.
    But he can’t even brake down the CPU on Legendary, because of his missing football brain.
  • Benja190782
    1418 posts Play-Off Hero
    Yeah so i dont get it. If everyone can do it. How are there people that are consitently the best or better. Were all in the same boat.
    Manual controls are just like any new additions. People would just learn to use it

    Year people would just learn to use it... ... PEOPLE CAN’T EXPLOIT THE GAME ON MANUAL CONTROLS for god sake! That’s the hole point of letting people control every input themself!

    They would be forced to show how good a virtual FOOTBALL player they really are!

  • Orison
    48741 posts FIFA Cover Star
    Orison wrote: »
    But you are playing on assisted as well. It's like when everybody got traction control on and you win the race.

    Your logic is flawed, because nobody is using manual controls in Fifa.

    No nobody is using manual controls. But wouldn’t it be fun to see how good people really are when they are on their own and not assisted? Wouldn’t it be fun to see who the REALLY good fifa players are?

    The people that doesn’t use exploits to win, but instead use their football brain to win!
    Wouldn’t it be more fair to let the best virtual football players win if they showed some actual skill on their own?

    Instead of letting a bunch of assisted ping pong noobs get rewarded for doing exploits?

    How about that, Orison? Huh?

    If manual controls were required to gain am advantage then the good players would learn it.

    Then they would go and abuse what works, but with manual controls. I'm sure you could first time shoot on manual shooting too, because the broken thing isn't the aiming, the broken thing is the active touch system and you can't deactivate that.

    To argue that the skill gap should be in having a football brain is laughable. The skill gap for any fifa title is to adapt to what works. If that’s manual controls then people would learn it. Learning and mastering the game mechanics is the skill, not moaning about your lack of that skill.
  • Thefranchise92
    3743 posts National Call-Up
    Yeah so i dont get it. If everyone can do it. How are there people that are consitently the best or better. Were all in the same boat.
    Manual controls are just like any new additions. People would just learn to use it

    Year people would just learn to use it... ... PEOPLE CAN’T EXPLOIT THE GAME ON MANUAL CONTROLS for god sake! That’s the hole point of letting people control every input themself!

    They would be forced to show how good a virtual FOOTBALL player they really are!

    Lol people will find a way to exploit it. News flash if you cant be the best of the best when you have a level playing field with assisted controls.. then you most certainly wont when its manual and you will have to adjust to. We all watch football in here.. thats why we play fifa.

    If your playing this game like real life seriously then thats your own fault
  • Crazy Creaky Jr
    2740 posts Fans' Favourite
    9/10 matches IRL are boring as ****
    You want that in a game aswell?
  • Koolfashion
    2668 posts Fans' Favourite
    EA has to create game for millions and not for 10 forum purists..

  • Thefranchise92
    3743 posts National Call-Up
    hooligan87 wrote: »
    Just divide us! Make the mode on manual control with slow speed! give us better rewards, so that other players are interested in it! This is an easy solution to the problem! No one is against it!

    I still dont get it. If playing assisted is so easy. why arent you an elite player?
  • Benja190782
    1418 posts Play-Off Hero
    I still dont get it. If playing assisted is so easy. why arent you an elite player?

    @Thefranchise92

    No you obviously still don’t get it. It’s because we are playing football, and playing football in FIFA means you won’t get rewarded.

    How can you not understand that we refuse to play that frenetic style of yours with exploits like ping pong passing and broken first time shots. How pathetic is that!?

    We play football in a football game, which should make sence, but it doesn’t as long as you guys keep telling EA to make the gameplay speed faster, so you can exploit the broken mechanics and stupid assists even more.

    How anyone can be proud of being assisted in a competitive game is beyond me. I mean how low can you go just to avoid being exposed. It’s pathetic!

    Cut the line between assisted arcade noobs and the real virtual football players are the only solution!

    We are here to play football, and should get rewarded for being able to control every input ourself, and show skills like true vision as a FIFA player, true tactical awareness with incredible composure as a FIFA player. That is something to be proud of. Doing button smashing and exploits is a crime, and should not be rewarded with anything else than a relegated club.
  • Thefranchise92
    3743 posts National Call-Up
    I still dont get it. If playing assisted is so easy. why arent you an elite player?

    @Thefranchise92

    No you obviously still don’t get it. It’s because we are playing football, and playing football in FIFA means you won’t get rewarded.

    How can you not understand that we refuse to play that frenetic style of yours with exploits like ping pong passing and broken first time shots. How pathetic is that!?

    We play football in a football game, which should make sence, but it doesn’t as long as you guys keep telling EA to make the gameplay speed faster, so you can exploit the broken mechanics and stupid assists even more.

    How anyone can be proud of being assisted in a competitive game is beyond me. I mean how low can you go just to avoid being exposed. It’s pathetic!

    Cut the line between assisted arcade noobs and the real virtual football players are the only solution!

    We are here to play football, and should get rewarded for being able to control every input ourself, and show skills like true vision as a FIFA player, true tactical awareness with incredible composure as a FIFA player. That is something to be proud of. Doing button smashing and exploits is a crime, and should not be rewarded with anything else than a relegated club.

    So your getting angry because your playing a video game and it isnt exactly like real life.. i agree some stuff like the spamming is ridiculous though. But football is 90 mins, this is 12 mins. Its like crying that scholes isnt like real life. Its hard to replicate. you can either keep using him knowing hes **** or use someone else..end of
  • mfmaxpower
    110 posts Has Potential To Be Special
    Assistance is NOT the main problem. The REAL problem is the lack of proper error and football fundamentals.

    Yes, the game is too assisted in attack. I agree. You shouldn't be rewarded with a goal when you're not even aiming at the target. Passing I don't have a huge issue with, but I would prefer it to be a little less assisted. I get my aiming fix from shooters, and don't want it to be the main determinant of who wins in a football game.

    There's WAY much more to football than just aim.

    The real issue though is the lack of error and real fundamentals in the game. I used to play in manual FIFA tournaments for money, and trust me, a high level manual player can still do some unrealistic BS ping pong passing. Maybe not as frequent as an assisted player, but the possibility is still there, and it still breaks with what should be possible in the game. Another example is with the stupid blind 180 degree spin and pass/shot. Playing manual all the sudden doesn't make those impossible.

    We need to move beyond this stupid manual vs assisted debate. Fact of the matter is EA will never introduce manual as default - for any mode - because it wouldn't be popular. Regardless, the game should be built to play with any assistance setting, and then people should choose their assistance settings based on personal preference, not because that's the only way to have a real skill gap or because it might play a bit more realistic.

    The solution is to find where realism and the skill gap can be married. First touch passing for example should have way higher error rates. So too with volleys and first time shots. Clearances are way too assisted and accurate, which makes starting counter attacks way too easy, while first touch can be too perfect at times, especially when receiving long passes and driven passes. And then there's the silly hyper animations that will allow you to do things that you shouldn't, both decreasing the skill gap and realism.

    We gotta move beyond this stupid assistance debate and focus on what's really important: focusing on the fundamentals and realism in the areas that also would benefit the skill gap. There's plenty of room for improvement here, that would both increase realism for us purists, while also increasing the skill gap for the competitive crowd, and assistance settings wouldn't need to be heavily modified.
  • Benja190782
    1418 posts Play-Off Hero
    edited August 29
    So your getting angry because your playing a video game and it isnt exactly like real life.. i agree some stuff like the spamming is ridiculous though.

    No I’m getting angry that ping pong passing, first time shots, flick up crosses etc etc. is being rewarded more than normal football.

    So everybody are searching for these exploits, instead of trying to bring the game back to the beautiful game of football.

    If you hate football so much, why are you playing a football game? Just to ruin it for as many people as possible!? It’s like driving a racing game just to crash into people.

  • Thefranchise92
    3743 posts National Call-Up
    So your getting angry because your playing a video game and it isnt exactly like real life.. i agree some stuff like the spamming is ridiculous though.

    No I’m getting angry that ping pong passing, first time shots, flick up crosses etc etc. is being rewarded more than normal football.

    So everybody are searching for these exploits, instead of trying to bring the game back to the beautiful game of football.

    If you hate football so much, why are you playing a football game? Just to ruin it for as many people as possible!? It’s like driving a racing game just to crash into people.

    Wtf i love football. And in normal h2h seasons its pretty normal. But fut is an arcade. In real life you cant have messi and ronaldo in the same team or add a hunter chem style onto someone.. fut is supposed to be slightly realsitic not wholly
  • Benja190782
    1418 posts Play-Off Hero
    @mfmaxpower Spot on! I agree on every word you said.
  • RMFisher
    46 posts Last Pick at the Park
    I can see both points of view, but to make the game manual would be mental from EA's perspective. It would make it too hard for the casual player. The sales would drop. Obviously none of you guys are casual players hence why you're on here.

    They should make different divisions for manual and market it as some form of professional FIFA. Also make pro FIFA manual. That would make it more competitive and encourage more to play that way.

    No matter if its assisted or manual, people will always look for exploits because so many are that obsessed with winning they will happily 'cheat/exploit' to do so.
  • Benja190782
    1418 posts Play-Off Hero
    edited August 29
    RMFisher wrote: »
    I can see both points of view, but to make the game manual would be mental from EA's perspective. It would make it too hard for the casual player. The sales would drop. Obviously none of you guys are casual players hence why you're on here.

    They should make different divisions for manual and market it as some form of professional FIFA. Also make pro FIFA manual. That would make it more competitive and encourage more to play that way.

    No matter if its assisted or manual, people will always look for exploits because so many are that obsessed with winning they will happily 'cheat/exploit' to do so.

    I agree. Maybe make division 10-5 assisted, 5-2 semi assisted, then division 1 and WL full manual. Also make bigger rewards in the best division, as playing manual takes some serious skills.

    Bigger rewards would encourage people to get up there and show some skill.
  • forearms
    4830 posts National Call-Up
    Diggy wrote: »
    forearms wrote: »
    Orison wrote: »
    forearms wrote: »
    Orison wrote: »
    Orison wrote: »
    If there is no skill involved how do the same people get Elite and top 100?

    Ofc there is skill involved lol. Most of us would double digit your son with relative ease unless he's a fut addict already and plays loads of games.

    @Orison please take your time and read the buttom of page 4. I want you to answer that question about how assisted passing is problem with all this, and not nessesary the gameplay speed.

    Do you understand what I’m talking about when I compare the assists of passing and a standing tackle?

    You see the problem?

    No, because I can hold my RB button and call for a 2nd men who then mirrors most movements of my opponent without me doing anything :trollface:

    Assists ain't going anywhere, because EA wouldn't sell any games without them. So you gotta ask yourself how to improve the game within certain boundaries.

    Even if you tried to argue for just qualifiers and tournaments to be played with manual controls it wouldn't work. People wouldn't watch the tournaments, because manual controls are so different from what the casuals are playing and in qualifiers you are playing on p2p connection against people from Russia. Good luck trying to execute manual passing and shooting while the game lags all over the place.

    You have really poor logic man.

    People wont watch tournaments? They're the best players. People want to watch the best. Doesnt matter if its football, bowling, poker, cornhole championships, or eSports. Pro golfers play under much stricter rules, and different dimensions than casuals. People still flock to pro events and get huge ratings.

    Lag? Its equally an issue either way. The game already favors the player with the better connection. Now you're worried about lag?

    Just call it like it is. You dont want to learn how to play manually.

    It's p2p. It doesn't favor anyone. It just lags.

    And no so far people aren't really interested in watching unless they can get rewards for it. They are put off by something as simple as the tournament accs having all players on it. Apparently it takes no skill to play with these squads and the casual can't relate to these pay2win teams. And that's not even a gameplay mechanic yet.

    But yeah under current circumstances I don't want to play with manual controls. Ofc I would learn it if it either was mandatory or would provide an advantage over assisted controls. However that will never be a thing until we get major engine and AI improvements.

    The tournaments are still watched. 245k people watched the eWorld Cup. I personally dont watch the events as most games look identical, including the squads they are playing with. I would find it more interesting if they drafted them, but I'm sure that's just my personal belief.

    I agree that the engine needs to go. Frostbite has been horrible for this franchise.

    No matter how I say it, I will always believe that all competitive modes should be full manual. I pointed it out now many times how many things the CPU decides for the users. We need much less AI intervention.

    I’m afraid Orison is right the assists are here for good for the less skilled players

    We just have to face EA won’t make a skill based game again

    I’ve accepted it

    My point was for competitive events. They should be manual. If players want to play with assisted controls, they can do it in friendlies, (and although I'm against it, Online Seasons). Weekend League, and tournaments at the very least should be manual.

    That would not effect casual players in the slightest. It wouldnt hurt them, as the vast majority of players dont play WL, and certainly not tournaments. The better players will still be better. I dont believe I'm better than them, and never once claimed to be. I only want less AI and CPU interference.

    Removing assists in competition, helps remove some of the "randomness" for the players. (Others may use different words there). How is that possibly a bad thing?
  • Orison
    48741 posts FIFA Cover Star
    forearms wrote: »
    Diggy wrote: »
    forearms wrote: »
    Orison wrote: »
    forearms wrote: »
    Orison wrote: »
    Orison wrote: »
    If there is no skill involved how do the same people get Elite and top 100?

    Ofc there is skill involved lol. Most of us would double digit your son with relative ease unless he's a fut addict already and plays loads of games.

    @Orison please take your time and read the buttom of page 4. I want you to answer that question about how assisted passing is problem with all this, and not nessesary the gameplay speed.

    Do you understand what I’m talking about when I compare the assists of passing and a standing tackle?

    You see the problem?

    No, because I can hold my RB button and call for a 2nd men who then mirrors most movements of my opponent without me doing anything :trollface:

    Assists ain't going anywhere, because EA wouldn't sell any games without them. So you gotta ask yourself how to improve the game within certain boundaries.

    Even if you tried to argue for just qualifiers and tournaments to be played with manual controls it wouldn't work. People wouldn't watch the tournaments, because manual controls are so different from what the casuals are playing and in qualifiers you are playing on p2p connection against people from Russia. Good luck trying to execute manual passing and shooting while the game lags all over the place.

    You have really poor logic man.

    People wont watch tournaments? They're the best players. People want to watch the best. Doesnt matter if its football, bowling, poker, cornhole championships, or eSports. Pro golfers play under much stricter rules, and different dimensions than casuals. People still flock to pro events and get huge ratings.

    Lag? Its equally an issue either way. The game already favors the player with the better connection. Now you're worried about lag?

    Just call it like it is. You dont want to learn how to play manually.

    It's p2p. It doesn't favor anyone. It just lags.

    And no so far people aren't really interested in watching unless they can get rewards for it. They are put off by something as simple as the tournament accs having all players on it. Apparently it takes no skill to play with these squads and the casual can't relate to these pay2win teams. And that's not even a gameplay mechanic yet.

    But yeah under current circumstances I don't want to play with manual controls. Ofc I would learn it if it either was mandatory or would provide an advantage over assisted controls. However that will never be a thing until we get major engine and AI improvements.

    The tournaments are still watched. 245k people watched the eWorld Cup. I personally dont watch the events as most games look identical, including the squads they are playing with. I would find it more interesting if they drafted them, but I'm sure that's just my personal belief.

    I agree that the engine needs to go. Frostbite has been horrible for this franchise.

    No matter how I say it, I will always believe that all competitive modes should be full manual. I pointed it out now many times how many things the CPU decides for the users. We need much less AI intervention.

    I’m afraid Orison is right the assists are here for good for the less skilled players

    We just have to face EA won’t make a skill based game again

    I’ve accepted it

    My point was for competitive events. They should be manual. If players want to play with assisted controls, they can do it in friendlies, (and although I'm against it, Online Seasons). Weekend League, and tournaments at the very least should be manual.

    That would not effect casual players in the slightest. It wouldnt hurt them, as the vast majority of players dont play WL, and certainly not tournaments. The better players will still be better. I dont believe I'm better than them, and never once claimed to be. I only want less AI and CPU interference.

    Removing assists in competition, helps remove some of the "randomness" for the players. (Others may use different words there). How is that possibly a bad thing?

    Because it won't work in the current game which also means it won't ever work in future games as long as we stay on a one year dev cycle and never get huge improvements.

    First of all qualifiers are p2p so one person with a bad con (or a large distance between players) ruins it for both and makes manual play basically impossible. Then we got servers that go down the drain everytime a promo hits on a Friday, more tragic games of passes not registering and what not. You can kinda get over it in an assisted game, you just pass somewhere else, in a manual game you would be screwed if the pass even came out just a fraction of a second too late, you would miss your target completely.

    Then there is the AI that is dumb as hell this year especially in attack. It doesn't even know how to run into space, it runs straight into defenders and gets stucked. Good luck trying to play manual through balls into space and what not.

    And then there is the engine itself with a weird collision detection, hitzones not lining up with the player models and so on. Almost unacceptable in an assisted game, absolutely game breaking in a manual one. Imagine lining up a pass/shot for the left foot and suddenly the player uses the right (which also clips straight through the other leg), your aim would be off and you would miss the pass/shot.

    Don't know how it's so difficult to understand, but it's IMPOSSIBLE for this game to be manual in its current state.
  • forearms
    4830 posts National Call-Up
    Impossible? There are people that play it manually right now. I don't think you know what impossible means.

    You want to complain about the Frostbite engine? I'm right there by your side. It's terrible. No amount of assisted controls are going to make it better.

    But then your answer for EA making a bad game with a terrible engine is to make the game decide more things for players? You have to see how ridiculous that sounds.
  • Orison
    48741 posts FIFA Cover Star
    forearms wrote: »
    Impossible? There are people that play it manually right now. I don't think you know what impossible means.

    You want to complain about the Frostbite engine? I'm right there by your side. It's terrible. No amount of assisted controls are going to make it better.

    But then your answer for EA making a bad game with a terrible engine is to make the game decide more things for players? You have to see how ridiculous that sounds.

    Who plays this game to a high level and plays manual?

    Exactly nobody. Ofc I could play toddlers on manual. But in WL you would get slapped around and WL isn't even that competitive anymore.
  • forearms
    4830 posts National Call-Up
    edited August 29
    Orison wrote: »
    forearms wrote: »
    Impossible? There are people that play it manually right now. I don't think you know what impossible means.

    You want to complain about the Frostbite engine? I'm right there by your side. It's terrible. No amount of assisted controls are going to make it better.

    But then your answer for EA making a bad game with a terrible engine is to make the game decide more things for players? You have to see how ridiculous that sounds.

    Who plays this game to a high level and plays manual?

    Exactly nobody. Ofc I could play toddlers on manual. But in WL you would get slapped around and WL isn't even that competitive anymore.

    We are going in circles here.

    The reason players chose to play with assisted controls is because it's easier. The player that chooses to play manually is at a disadvantage to the assisted player right now. You're right about that. The reason is due to how much the computer actually assists the non-manual player.

    *They are able to spam the pass button to 98% effectiveness all over the field, no matter how quickly or in what direction the stick is pressed. The CPU decides exactly where each pass goes.

    *They can point a shot at the corner flag and still score. The CPU decides exactly where the shot will go.

    *They can blast a through ball as hard as possible and not have to worry that it is going too far. The CPU decides exactly how far it will go.


    None of this is debatable. People choose to play with assisted controls because of how much easier it is. It's not because of connection. Assisted=helped. People will almost always choose something easier, especially when combined with being helped.


    All of the * points above show that it wasnt the player, but the CPU that decided the direct outcomes. In a competition between 2 players, why should the CPU decide so many things that the players should be deciding? If competitive modes were manual, it would be the players deciding those events.


    I know, the game is broken, AI is flawed and connection is a problem on P2P. And now we are back full circle.
  • Thefranchise92
    3743 posts National Call-Up
    This is pointless. The game will never make it mandatory for manual to be enforced.
  • Dunkirk
    158 posts Has Potential To Be Special
    no surprise that the idiots in this thread that don’t want less assisted gameplay, more user input etc need 1000 explanations to grasp what the people with brains are actually trying to say. comical stuff
  • tarheels_forever
    600 posts An Exciting Prospect
    Definitely, gameplay needs to slow down. I understand that many people don't like that idea, because they don't understand real football, but EA should be more responsible and teach all the kids playing this game what football really is, gameplay must be slow, same speed as real football is, with real physics simulation.

    so everybody that doesnt want the game to slow down doesnt understand real football huh? ......OK
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